Studio in a Shed

[GuitarBilly]

Hey guys...

So we are toying with the idea of staying with my mother-in-law long term since she needs our help on financial and personal matters. I am not getting into the personal details here but I am not opposed to the idea but I need to have my dedicated space for a studio/music room. While there is space to do it inside the house I was thinking about taking advantage of the large backyard we have here and build the studio outside in a shed. I don't have too much of a plan right now (hence the thread) but I was thinking about getting a 12x16 shed, having it installed in a concrete foundation and then adding insulation/drywall, electrical outlets and AC/heater combo to it.


So first, is this a crazy idea? I think it's totally doable but any issues I should be aware of? Also what would be the ideal size? Is 12x16 too big given that we are not playing to have any drums or very loud amps in it?

I've seen some YT videos of similar projects and some of them are really cool:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfooVlzQqTo[/youtube]

What do you guys think?

[TurboPablo]

Do it. Buy a nice pre fab and set it up. Try to locate it close to the house.

[mortatone]

He mentioned the 1st thing that came to mind which is the loud AC units. Window units, the portable one on wheels like he had, and P-tec (hotel style) units are all too loud for a studio setting. A simple heat pump ductless mini-split would be ideal but they aren't cheap. The lowest cost one I've installed for someone was $2500 which included running an electrical circuit, and most companies charge more than I do. I think they have some that are designed to be able to be installed in a DIY manner but I'm not familiar with them. Might wanna study up on that and in your travels if you see a ductless unit on the wall pay attention to how much noise it makes. Some of them are very quiet. All of them are quieter than a window unit, although I have seen some pretty quiet window units (also the blower speeds can be slowed down for quieter operation while recording). The ductless mini splits also don't use much electricity so that's a bonus too.

Sounds like a fun project. What are you thinking for total budget?

[clipless bumper]

I don't think 12x16 is to big, more like too small IMO. I would also like higher than normal, or vaulted ceilings to cut down on reflections.

You also need to check out any zoning obstacles for a shed that is really more than a shed, since it will be climate controlled.

[skybluegary]

I think it's a great idea, go for it.

[mortatone]

I don't think 12x16 is to big, more like too small IMO. I would also like higher than normal, or vaulted ceilings to cut down on reflections.

You also need to check out any zoning obstacles for a shed that is really more than a shed, since it will be climate controlled.

Or just put up the shed, get it inspected, then do wtf you want.

[GuitarBilly]

He mentioned the 1st thing that came to mind which is the loud AC units. Window units, the portable one on wheels like he had, and P-tec (hotel style) units are all too loud for a studio setting. A simple heat pump ductless mini-split would be ideal but they aren't cheap. The lowest cost one I've installed for someone was $2500 which included running an electrical circuit, and most companies charge more than I do. I think they have some that are designed to be able to be installed in a DIY manner but I'm not familiar with them. Might wanna study up on that and in your travels if you see a ductless unit on the wall pay attention to how much noise it makes. Some of them are very quiet. All of them are quieter than a window unit, although I have seen some pretty quiet window units (also the blower speeds can be slowed down for quieter operation while recording). The ductless mini splits also don't use much electricity so that's a bonus too.

Sounds like a fun project. What are you thinking for total budget?

I was thinking of getting something like this and having it installed for me. My son works as a HVAC tech and said all I need to do is give him a roundtrip ticket and he will do it. What do you think of this unit?

https://www.pioneerminisplit.com/produc ... duct_sync&


Total budget.... maybe $8-10k although I could go a bit higher.

I don't think 12x16 is to big, more like too small IMO. I would also like higher than normal, or vaulted ceilings to cut down on reflections.

You also need to check out any zoning obstacles for a shed that is really more than a shed, since it will be climate controlled.

I don't think 12x16 is too small. My basement was a 13x14 and I had plenty of space for what I needed with room to spare. Definitely going for valted or barn style ceiling. Also I want 7ft walls minimum.

The zoning tip is a good one. Definitely need to check on that.

[mortatone]

I'll ask in an hvac fb group what the quietest system is. I don't know that brand but I assume they're all decent unless I see a reason to think otherwise from my own experience.

[GuitarBilly]

I'll ask in an hvac fb group what the quietest system is. I don't know that brand but I assume they're all decent unless I see a reason to think otherwise from my own experience.

Thanks man I appreciate it


These are the noise level in their spec sheet, actually not bad

INDOOR UNIT DATA
Sound Level (Hi/Med/Lo): 38 / 32 / 25 dB(A)
Net Dimensions (WDH): 28.43 x 7.36 x 11.42 Inches
Carton Dimensions (WDH): 31.1 x 10.63 x 14.76 Inches
Net / Gross Weight: 17.2 / 22.71 lbs

OUTDOOR UNIT DATA
Sound Level: 52.0 dB(A)

[mortatone]

I'll ask in an hvac fb group what the quietest system is. I don't know that brand but I assume they're all decent unless I see a reason to think otherwise from my own experience.

Thanks man I appreciate it


These are the noise level in their spec sheet, actually not bad

INDOOR UNIT DATA
Sound Level (Hi/Med/Lo): 38 / 32 / 25 dB(A)
Net Dimensions (WDH): 28.43 x 7.36 x 11.42 Inches
Carton Dimensions (WDH): 31.1 x 10.63 x 14.76 Inches
Net / Gross Weight: 17.2 / 22.71 lbs

OUTDOOR UNIT DATA
Sound Level: 52.0 dB(A)

Oh shit I didn't even know that was listed in the specs. Some contractor I am!

I'm actually still pretty green on alot of the contractor aspects of the trade. Been doing the work for a couple of decades but have only recently been exposed to the full monty of cooling considerations. I can fix/install the shit of of some equipment but design, specs and decision making is a different animal.

[GuitarBilly]

I'll ask in an hvac fb group what the quietest system is. I don't know that brand but I assume they're all decent unless I see a reason to think otherwise from my own experience.

Thanks man I appreciate it


These are the noise level in their spec sheet, actually not bad

INDOOR UNIT DATA
Sound Level (Hi/Med/Lo): 38 / 32 / 25 dB(A)
Net Dimensions (WDH): 28.43 x 7.36 x 11.42 Inches
Carton Dimensions (WDH): 31.1 x 10.63 x 14.76 Inches
Net / Gross Weight: 17.2 / 22.71 lbs

OUTDOOR UNIT DATA
Sound Level: 52.0 dB(A)

Oh shit I didn't even know that was listed in the specs. Some contractor I am!

I'm actually still pretty green on alot of the contractor aspects of the trade. Been doing the work for a couple of decades but have only recently been exposed to the full monty of cooling considerations. I can fix/install the shit of of some equipment but design, specs and decision making is a different animal.

ha no worries man.

I'm the opposite, I'm a business analyst so design, specs, stats etc is my wheelhouse but don't ask me to actually install anything

[mortatone]

Mitsubishi seems to be the gold standard for mini splits. I've installed exactly one Mitsu system which was a single condenser dual head system. That was a couple of months ago and haven't had any calls on it. Expensive but reportedly very reliable and service friendly. The noise specs on a basic system were similar slightly under the pioneer. Someone also mentioned Daikin and that some models were geared toward quiet. That should be some decent search fodder. I'd look but I'm running down a bunch of thought lines tonight and about to crash.

[GuitarBilly]

Cool thanks!!! This one fits my budget and should be enough for an insulated shed, I think:

https://www.ecomfort.com/Mitsubishi-MZ- ... 81583.html

[neilrocks25]

Not Crazy at all apart from some bad financial things that have happened due to what's going on in the world and some tax changes, I am planning the same when we are back on our feet, I have been looking onto either a shed build or a loft build the shed might be better if anything as long as you have the size its room within a room and its not too cold or hot.

Hey guys...

So we are toying with the idea of staying with my mother-in-law long term since she needs our help on financial and personal matters. I am not getting into the personal details here but I am not opposed to the idea but I need to have my dedicated space for a studio/music room. While there is space to do it inside the house I was thinking about taking advantage of the large backyard we have here and build the studio outside in a shed. I don't have too much of a plan right now (hence the thread) but I was thinking about getting a 12x16 shed, having it installed in a concrete foundation and then adding insulation/drywall, electrical outlets and AC/heater combo to it.


So first, is this a crazy idea? I think it's totally doable but any issues I should be aware of? Also what would be the ideal size? Is 12x16 too big given that we are not playing to have any drums or very loud amps in it?

I've seen some YT videos of similar projects and some of them are really cool:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfooVlzQqTo[/youtube]

What do you guys think?

[Marc G]

cool idea man..... as far as HVAC noise goes, if you're recording guitars and bass direct, programming drums and using software instruments for keys the only time HVAC noise will be an issue would be when you're recording vocals. The solution to that would be, kill the HVAC when tracking vocals OR, build a small vocal booth. That being said I have a split window unit about 6 feet away from my computer and when I've recorded guitar mic'd up and voiceovers for Podcasts etc I've never noticed any background noise, I might be one of the exceptions really. The safest thing would be to install the HVAC unit on the opposite side of the room to your workstation and hopefully away from anything you plan on putting a mic on.

[K-Bizzle]

The only concern I'd have is that construction materials and wood in general are expensive AF right now.

I can only assume this would affect the price of making something like this vs 1-2 years ago. Hell 2x4s are like $8 now most places (wtf?) these days, its really annoying.
Also ROI? I mean if you don't HAVE to spend that much will you get a requisite increase in property value to make it worth it?

I'm sure none of these things are the types of thoughts you were asking for but its the first place my mind goes.

[Devin]

My buddy has his studio setup in a lil shed next to his house right now. Couldn't tell you the dimensions but he actually just started working on expanding it. I say do it

[nightflameauto]

I'd say do it, but do some pricing first. You may be able to build it like a real building (house) if you plan on putting insulation and drywall in it anyway for cheaper than the pre-fabs if you have the ability to do it. We have a 12x24 foot in the back yard we built that way as a shop and storage and it wasn't much more than a prefab of the same size that would still need the drywall and insulation. I always thought seriously about turning it into a shop if we ever decluttered. It's got two rooms with an insulated dividing wall between and a heavy double-pane glass door between them for just such purpose.

Granted, we have relatives in construction so we may have gotten off cheap.

At any rate, sounds like a cool project with no real downsides.

[fretless]

I've done this , it's hot .. small.. but totally doable .

[GuitarBilly]

cool idea man..... as far as HVAC noise goes, if you're recording guitars and bass direct, programming drums and using software instruments for keys the only time HVAC noise will be an issue would be when you're recording vocals. The solution to that would be, kill the HVAC when tracking vocals OR, build a small vocal booth. That being said I have a split window unit about 6 feet away from my computer and when I've recorded guitar mic'd up and voiceovers for Podcasts etc I've never noticed any background noise, I might be one of the exceptions really. The safest thing would be to install the HVAC unit on the opposite side of the room to your workstation and hopefully away from anything you plan on putting a mic on.

yeah most of what I do is DI anyway so the noise is only an issue for vocal mics. I do like the idea of the mini split unit Mortatone suggested though as it seems to be the quietest. I would be good to keep noise to a minimum when mixing etc...

The only concern I'd have is that construction materials and wood in general are expensive AF right now.

I can only assume this would affect the price of making something like this vs 1-2 years ago. Hell 2x4s are like $8 now most places (wtf?) these days, its really annoying.
Also ROI? I mean if you don't HAVE to spend that much will you get a requisite increase in property value to make it worth it?

I'm sure none of these things are the types of thoughts you were asking for but its the first place my mind goes.

Yeah I am most likely buying a prefab shed but I will still have to buy some material like insulation drywall etc... so that's definitely something to consider.

I'd say do it, but do some pricing first. You may be able to build it like a real building (house) if you plan on putting insulation and drywall in it anyway for cheaper than the pre-fabs if you have the ability to do it. We have a 12x24 foot in the back yard we built that way as a shop and storage and it wasn't much more than a prefab of the same size that would still need the drywall and insulation. I always thought seriously about turning it into a shop if we ever decluttered. It's got two rooms with an insulated dividing wall between and a heavy double-pane glass door between them for just such purpose.

Granted, we have relatives in construction so we may have gotten off cheap.

At any rate, sounds like a cool project with no real downsides.

Kimmi does have a cousin in construction so I will check with him for sure and compare with prefab prices. I also will get quotes from several prefab companies and compare prices as it seems they can vary wildly from a company to another.

[Tortuga]

I'd say if you're gonna do it, don't fuck around

Look at prefab units. What Kyle said about wood costs are absolutely true - it's a fucking shame where pricing has hit, but it is what it is. Maybe the bubble will burst, but I wouldn't count on it.

Besides a concrete foundation, you're looking at need for power, A/C, lighting, and all the rest. If you're going to try to mitigate (don't even think about full "soundproof") the sound a lot, you may want to look at doing a wall within wall configuration like I did in the garage. If you do that, build staggered studs in the studio walls and fill them with rockwool. Save the environmental insulation for the outer building's walls. I put in a "temporary" A/C unit in my studio, with an exhaust port and two 4" air intakes down low in the walls (to get cooler air) and sealed the fuck out of the studio walls (all around the drywall perimeters) with acoustic caulk. I also put all my electrical boxes on top of the drywall instead of cutting them in, which helped tremendously. If you have any pounding (ie drums, loud bass, etc.), you may want to build in a raised floor or at least do a raised platform for those sound sources that has been double-studded and filled with rockwool.

[GuitarBilly]

I'd say if you're gonna do it, don't fuck around

Look at prefab units. What Kyle said about wood costs are absolutely true - it's a fucking shame where pricing has hit, but it is what it is. Maybe the bubble will burst, but I wouldn't count on it.

Besides a concrete foundation, you're looking at need for power, A/C, lighting, and all the rest. If you're going to try to mitigate (don't even think about full "soundproof") the sound a lot, you may want to look at doing a wall within wall configuration like I did in the garage. If you do that, build staggered studs in the studio walls and fill them with rockwool. Save the environmental insulation for the outer building's walls. I put in a "temporary" A/C unit in my studio, with an exhaust port and two 4" air intakes down low in the walls (to get cooler air) and sealed the fuck out of the studio walls (all around the drywall perimeters) with acoustic caulk. I also put all my electrical boxes on top of the drywall instead of cutting them in, which helped tremendously. If you have any pounding (ie drums, loud bass, etc.), you may want to build in a raised floor or at least do a raised platform for those sound sources that has been double-studded and filled with rockwool.

yeah I did some asking this morning and it seems like prefab is definitely the way to go. I also realized I really don't need a 12x16 room. I decided to go with a 10x12 with 8ft high walls. Found some companies today that can do it for $3000-4000k depending on finishes etc... that gives me about $6-7k for the electrical, AC, insulation etc.. so it seems doable.

The sound mitigation will be done with the gear rather than the room. So DI for amps, e-drum kit etc.. Even if I choose to mic an amp, with the PS100 I just bought, I can put my Marshall in its sweet spot then bring them volume down to be just loud enough for close mic'ing, which is not much volume at all. I really don't anticipate having anything louder than TV level. I think it is a lot easier to get good results that way.

[mortatone]

I've been thinking about this thread and an empty residential 1/2 acre lot we own in the next town over.

I had thought of building a house there as a rental property and maybe putting a storage building way out back that would be for me and whatever I want to use it for.

Now I'm wondering if rent would cover the cost of both buildings..... free studio space (kinda)

Might sound cheesy but I would love to have a studio that's extremely low/no cost to musicians and that might be an efficient way to get the space to do it

[clipless bumper]

Then you could rent the house to musicians, but you would have to redo the interior every six months......

[GuitarBilly]

I've been thinking about this thread and an empty residential 1/2 acre lot we own in the next town over.

I had thought of building a house there as a rental property and maybe putting a storage building way out back that would be for me and whatever I want to use it for.

Now I'm wondering if rent would cover the cost of both buildings..... free studio space (kinda)

Might sound cheesy but I would love to have a studio that's extremely low/no cost to musicians and that might be an efficient way to get the space to do it

I can't answer for FL but I've had a similar situation with my house in Los Angeles for years. I converted my garage into a rental property so it would help me pay my mortgage.

I found out that to rent out the guest house, I had to apply for a separate address with the county.
So my house number is 19002 and the guest house became 19002A. Otherwise, if I rented out the guest house without a dedicated address registered with the county, for all legal purposes they would be considered renters in my house and had to be granted access to the main house. I also had to apply for a separate power meter, but water could be shared.

Keep in mind this is LA county in California, which is notorious for finding incredibly creative ways of taking your money with useless paperwork.

But check with your county so you don't have the renters legally getting into your studio/storage building.