Hello Noob Here With Big Question

[d3adleavez]

Hello So I have multiple les pauls to use but I'm looking for a reasonably priced amp to be able to cover 3 specific songs, those bing (lateralus, descending, and 10,000 days) I also have a diesel vh4 pedal to use. I'm not sure where it's better to go the route of using something like amplitube4 or some kind of amp sim or get either a marshall dsl40cr or Hughes&Kettner grandmeister 40...I would also love to be able to cover 70's-80's hard rock like black sabbath, did, motley true etc etc...Any help for a tone noob would be helpful thank you guys...Also living in a decently sized house but anticipate moving to an apartment soon so best tone at lowest volume would be a factor as well sadly. THANK YOU!!

[RyanDistortion]

Well, if you like the VH4 enough by itself, you should get an amp that takes pedals well and use it to make the pedal "be your sound". The dsl40c would be a good choice for 2 reasons.
1) it has a master volume and the green channel with your VH4 pedal should work great.

2) Adam Jones uses a Marshall super bass amp so the inherit Marshall sound is also in that amp. It's a combo with a master volume so you can really tame your volume while maintaining the distorted sound.

Just swap out that stock speaker with something better and you'll be money.

[Ry Manchu]

There are a few ways to tackle this.

1) Diezel pedal into Marshall-ish amp: DSL40, DSL50, Boss Katana, Marshall 8100, Marshall VS100, Marshall Lead 100 Mosfet, Ceriatone Son of Yeti, Ceriatone 2525, Marshall 2525, Bugera 1990, Krank Nineteen80, Krank Chadwick, Peavey Butcher, Peavey VTM, Peavey Windsor, Ampeg VL-501, Randall RG100, Splawn Quickrod, VHT Deliverance, Orange OR15, Orange Rocker 30

2) Modeler with good Mesa or Diezel sim: Line 6 Helix, Blackstar ID:60, Neural DSP Quad Cortex

3) Mesa DR-ish amp: PRS MT15, PRS Archon, Panama Shaman, Traynor YCV, Carvin V3, Mesa F30, Randall RM w/ Mesa or Diezel pre

4) Mesa DR-ish Preamp: ADA MP-1 w/ 3TM or 3.666 mod, Mesa Rectifier Recording, Rocktron Piranha, Mesa Triaxis (look for a version 2.0 model)

Solutions 3 and 4 aren't going to work very well for Crue or Sabbath, except the Triaxis, Shaman, YCV and Randall RM can get you in the direction of Mick Mars, the others, not so much. Most of the amps that will get you sounding like Sabbath are too loud for an apt. I'm not big on playing guitar into a computer, but there are some killer clips from Amplitude. I don't really think the H&K sounds like any of the bands you're describing, but Tommy Thayer uses a duotone to get a pretty good boosted Plexi sound, so maybe I'm wrong.

If it were me, either a DSL50 or PRS Archon into an OS 1x12 cab with a V30. If the walls of the apt. are paper thin, then the Katana, RG100, Lead 100 Mosfet, Helix, Quad Cortex or Blackstar.

[d3adleavez]

Awesome answers guys, better than some of what I got on the other forums which turned into les paul vs tele. I did forget to mention I do have a little Orange micro dark terror but I'm not sure how well that would work honestly. It seems the DSL40 is the consensus I get from the most well spoke answers...I don't know much on modelers so if anyone has the patience to try and break that down to me in easy terms I'd appreciate it. Also in regards to changing out the speaker of the DSL, Which speaker would one suggest I go with to achieve my stated goal? Thanks again guys that helps a lot and probably saves me a lot of money..And I guess with that comes one more question, pedals...I'm sure I could find the other guys no problem but apparently Jones is secretive but from what I've found I would need a boss flanger, a dd3 and a volume pedal? Any Ideas on the volume pedal? I was looking at the Ernie Ball but again I'm always looking for suggestions. Thanks again!

[Ry Manchu]

I'll try to answer as many of your questions as I can. I don't know how in depth you want of an explanation for modelling amps. Billy could better answer as he helped design a line of products from Line 6. From what I understand they are basically very precise equalizers. They peak and valley across the audible frequency spectrum in a similar way as the amp that they are trying to sound like. I prefer modellers that tell you what amp they are trying to copy. But I'll take one that makes four unnamed good sounds over 20 mediocre named ones. I also prefer ones that allow users to upload patches they've created to a central database. I like to use these as a starting point to dial in what sounds good to my ears.

I'm not a big fan of buying an amp to promptly swap its speaker, however I am guilty of having done that. You personally may like the 70/80 in the DSL40C, however swapping it is very common. You would save a little money by finding a used one that has already been swapped. I can think of 25 speakers that will work in the DSL40C off the top of my head. However, since it's Tool tones that you're after. I would stick with something in the Vintage 30 arena. That would include the Celestion Vintage 30, Eminence Governor, Eminence Tonker, WGS Veteran 30 and WGS Retro 30. If you really want me to list the others, I will, but it would be best to have a direction that you're shooting for, e.g. Sabbath, Tony Iommi has used G12T-75, G12M Greenback and G12H speakers. Mick Mars used G12T-75, G12M and Vintage 30 speakers. The G12T-75 isn't the best choice for an apartment.

For a simple Adam Jones pedal board you'll need a talk box, a delay pedal, a flanger, a wah, a volume pedal and maybe a chorus and bass synth.

Talk Box: Heil HT-1, Foxx Tone Machine
Delay: Boss DD-3, Boss DD-5, Line 6 DL4, Maxon AD-9, MXR Carbon Copy
Flanger: Boss BF-2, Boss BF-3, Maxon FL-9
Wah: Dunlop 535Q (mostly left in cocked position)
Volume pedal: just about any 250K, but the Ernie Ball is solid
Bass Synth: Boss SYB-5
Chorus: Boss CE-2

I've never played a Micro Dark, so I can't really say. I think the Jim Root Terror can pull off a tone that is a cousin of modern Marshall tones.

[d3adleavez]

I'm kinda leaning toward the DSL option as I understand it I can cut the power back to 20 if I want as well which could be a plus and honestly I know nothing about modelers so that intimidates me lol. Is there a video or something you can recommend that might help me understand it better without sifting through a bunch of paid content? I think I'm good on the pedals, pickups and really everything else but a bass synth. Thanks for the help again being new to this side is like a new planet.

[Ry Manchu]

I've tried a lot of volume solutions: half power switches, power scaling, volume pedal in the loop, attenuators, loop return levels, inefficient speakers. It always comes back to the basics, an amp with volume controls that you can dial in at the volumes you play and speakers that you like the way they sound. I like the volume controls on the DSL and the PRS amps as far as hard rock tube amps go. I almost never use the half power or 1/10th power switches because the amps usually sound anemic. I also use headphones when people are trying to sleep. It's easier to dial in a decent tone at a lower volume on solid state and modellers. Some solid state amps sound great loud, some don't. Some solid state amps sound better with a boost pedal, some don't.

This guy does a pretty good job showing how to dial in a Mesa sound on the Blackstar Core (warning: he goes down the rabbit hole):

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMDVyuw9C0M[/youtube]

[Ry Manchu]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZdCRB2cf6s[/youtube]
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJjhUh3-ETk[/youtube]
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kei7R7hhp84[/youtube]
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myqHmKPpAss[/youtube]
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZW7JPTAapEk[/youtube]

[d3adleavez]

Awesome info man thanks, I needed that...While doing some online research I came across this guy on youtube who seems to nail the Tool aspect of what I'm going for. I'll link his stuff. If you can help me figure out what he's using I think I could close that part of the mystery

https://www.youtube.com/c/axeofcreation/videos

specifically this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNU1z4EwQ6A

And if you anyone thinks they can achieve this somewhat cheap with an amp and pedals I'd love to hear it. But It seems digital might be the route I choose to take for their sound.

[RyanDistortion]

You could ask in the comments section of their YouTube.

[Ry Manchu]

I don't know what he used on that specific video. I have watched other of his Tool videos and can tell you what he has used on some. Revv G20 head, Revv G3 pedal, Diezel VH4 pedal, Panama Shaman head. I thought one of the videos where he ran the Revv G20 head directly into his DAW sounded head and shoulders better than the others. Made me want to buy a G20. Write to the guy. Invite him here. I bet he'd join, as I bet these videos are his primary income now.

[d3adleavez]

Yeah I just assume I'll be overlooked in the comments but I'll give it a shot next time he posts a new vid and hope he skims them. Another amp I checked out that looks interesting is this thing. And with this huge economic package coming honestly I'd put that 1400 along with the 1500 I've got.

Here's a look at that amp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7NLGL7 ... JrozQVmVZ3

It does look a little large for my purposes but sounded good to me. Thanks for the help again. I'll ask that dude about his gear if I get any good info I'll post it here if anyone is interested.

[Ry Manchu]

I've seen that video and it does sound badass, but, I have a hard time with $3000 for a JCM 800 clone. I got mine for $500.

[d3adleavez]

Oh damn I didn't see the price tag, I thought it was around $1,400. Yeah I can't justify that. It seems to me a lot of what i'm liking and what's looking practical is going the digital route.. Is there a specific place on this or another forum for that you'd recommend I orient myself with while I hopefully see what that youtuber has set up?

[d3adleavez]

I also came across a 25 watt mini mesa boogie rectifier, how do you think that would sound paired with my diesel pedal? That's about the only other physical amp I think I'd consider before going the other routes mentioned.

[Ostinato Rubato]

For the songs you listed I wouldn't go with the Mesa. The mesa sound was most used during the Aenima album. I would have more confidence that your VH4 pedal will work better with the DSL40C's clean channel, which takes pedals really well.

Have fun overthinking/overanalyzing severing the body from the mind.

[d3adleavez]

Yeah I realized how hugely different the sound was after listening to a couple demos of the Mesa, it sounds like an impressive little thing but not what I need. After talking with some of you and some others I think the DSL or learning more about sims is gonna be the way to go. Honestly I'll prob do both because I do enjoy having a physical amp there but the convenience of being ale to take a laptop with me is appealing too even if the tone sounds a little neutered. Idk if you guys close threads or just leave it up but thanks again to everyone!