Guitar Gear Forum

Tone.

It's very debatable

I have an issue with Boss pedals in some effects loops because of their input impedance being low.

In front of the amp, they're good.

They’re fine when engaged and usually the effect is great.

They all suck tone in bypass. Not debatable.

We're already debating it.

So it's debatable. : lol:

No.

I just had to clarify the FACT I was pointing out was different than the FACT you pointed out.

Now that that’s established - not debatable.

I bump the presence and/or treble as needed and don't worry about it.

For a FACT my Boss SD1, DS1, OD3 TU2 etc don't suck tone.
Some of their digital pedals do. But not all.

Debatable again.

TurboPablo wrote:I bump the presence and/or treble as needed and don't worry about it.

We are not the same.

GuitarBilly wrote:For a FACT my Boss SD1, DS1, OD3 TU2 etc don't suck tone.
Some of their digital pedals do. But not all.

Debatable again.

Proper dry signal tests were conducted and concluded that all BOSS pedals suck tone when bypassed.

It’s a really hard thing to accept.

Ostinato Rubato wrote:

TurboPablo wrote:I bump the presence and/or treble as needed and don't worry about it.

We are not the same.

I know.

I play guitar.

You play synth.

The problem with these tests is that no one use the pedals in those conditions, so they're utterly useless.
My Marshall sounds exactly the same straight in or with bypassed Boss pedals in front of them and at the end of the day that's what matters.


It reminds of those modeler blind tests the people do to "prove" a Helix and a Marshall "sound the same". No they don't, despite of your lab test results.

With Boss is the same thing, you can do dry signal tests all you want, at the end of the day I'll put them in front of my amp with no detriment to my tone. And so do many players know for great tone.

And given that that's what people buy them for, the lab results are not very important.

SD-1 has permanent residence on my board. It just works.

just use a pedal with a good buffer or a stand alone buffer before the Boss pedal.... problem solved... I won't let Boss's meh buffers stop me from using my TR-2 or PH-2

Baited is more like it. Lol

fretless wrote:Baited is more like it. Lol

I don't think you know what baited means. But a gear discussion on a gear forum is not being baited by any means. That's what the forum is here for.

Marc G wrote:just use a pedal with a good buffer or a stand alone buffer before the Boss pedal.... problem solved... I won't let Boss's meh buffers stop me from using my TR-2 or PH-2

Yeah using a buffer definitely helps but I rarely had a Boss pedal in front of my amp that I thought changed my tone in any noticeable matter. Maybe some of their older units or a few specific models.

In the loop it's a different story, I've definitely had some Boss pedals really suck tone and dynamics through the effects loop of some amps, it's usually their digital pedals. The DD3, for example, doesn't like the DSL or EVH loops. But through the Metro loop on my JMP or the Friedman Runt loop it is fine.
The DD500 works on every loop I've tried so far.

On the other hand, a SD1 bypassed in front of an amp will make exactly zero audible difference in the amps tone. Let alone in front of an overdriven amp, like most people use them. That's just nonsense.
So it depends on the pedal and where is at in the signal chain.

Metro loops and lossless loops in general are a different beast. I can dial the mix setting on my El Capistan way back vs where I would normally have it on any tube buffered loop and still get the same effect. They ain’t lying about how good those are.

greatmutah wrote:I can dial the mix setting on my El Capistan way back vs where I would normally have it on any tube buffered loop and still get the same effect.

I've noticed that too.

I have so much stuff in whatever rig I am using at a given moment that tone suck is probably happening but I am not aware of it On the topic of their dirt; the SD 40th anniversary I have looks killer but I am not drawn to it. I know it's a classic like the TS but I can't seem to jive with it for whatever reason. After grabbing a Mooer Blues Driver clone; I will be drawing myself to the real thing here sometime this year. Finally

People who care about this too much probably agonize over string gauge.

JiveTurkey wrote:I have so much stuff in whatever rig I am using at a given moment that tone suck is probably happening but I am not aware of it On the topic of their dirt; the SD 40th anniversary I have looks killer but I am not drawn to it. I know it's a classic like the TS but I can't seem to jive with it for whatever reason. After grabbing a Mooer Blues Driver clone; I will be drawing myself to the real thing here sometime this year. Finally

Yeah that's how I tend to look at it too. Does the rig sound good overall? If it does, I won't stress over any frequency loss or boost at every piece of the chain.

A lot of these subtleties get lost anyway, especially in a live mix. I used to be really picky about my effects but honestly it's very hard to hear any differences between say different delays, reverbs etc when you're playing at volume with a band.

In the studio, that's more critical but I record dry and add everything in post anyway.

Honestly I wish I could do the same thing live. If I was in a situation where I was gigging with my own PA and sound guy every time, I'd just run the amp dry and add the effects on the board, unless it's something that's an integral part of the song. But the ambience stuff is always better done in post so it can be tuned to the room.

Zozobra wrote:People who care about this too much probably agonize over string gauge.

Good response!

SD-1 and OD-3 absolutely suck tone from dry signal in bypass. OD-3 was my favorite BOSS overdrive so it sucked to accept it. And I don’t have the patience for pedals that need a looper.

In the world we live in, with so many other non-tone sucking options, why even BOSS bros?

Go do it if you’re brave enough. Go do the dry signal test. Just one BOSS pedal in the chain. Rotate all your favorites one by one. Cry as they disappointed you like failed heirs.

TurboPablo wrote:

Ostinato Rubato wrote:

TurboPablo wrote:I bump the presence and/or treble as needed and don't worry about it.

We are not the same.

I know.

I play guitar.

You play synth.

You’d be wise not to awaken the sleeping glove.

I don’t own any boss pedals atm, but the loop of my mrakv sucks tone so bad that I have to leave it engaged full time if I have anything in the loop